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Post by valdemar on Oct 25, 2017 6:33:01 GMT
Anyone here been reading these? I kept seeing them mentioned in glowing terms, and so I got the short story collection, 'England's Glory', to ease me in to their strange world. It took ten pages to become hooked. Within the month, I had every book in the series, and worked my way through them. A totally enjoyable journey, to be sure. Enjoyable on a similar level to Ben Aaronovitch's deliciously odd 'Rivers Of London' series, and Andrew Cartmel's brilliantly nerdy 'Vinyl Detective' books. Bryant and May's London is the London that fascinates me, where tourist has never trod. Oddly, my impressions of the main characters were that they looked (in my mind's eye) like Arthur Lowe (Bryant), and John Le Mesurier (May). Their first names are Arthur and John, but so are a lot of people. Christopher Fowler said on his website, that they were definitely based on Lowe and Le Mesurier. I only found his website some time after reading the books.Whatever, I do enjoy their often barking plots, and well-drawn characters.
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Post by ropardoe on Oct 25, 2017 8:23:51 GMT
Anyone here been reading these? I kept seeing them mentioned in glowing terms, and so I got the short story collection, 'England's Glory', to ease me in to their strange world. It took ten pages to become hooked. Within the month, I had every book in the series, and worked my way through them. A totally enjoyable journey, to be sure. Enjoyable on a similar level to Ben Aaronovitch's deliciously odd 'Rivers Of London' series, and Andrew Cartmel's brilliantly nerdy 'Vinyl Detective' books. Bryant and May's London is the London that fascinates me, where tourist has never trod. Oddly, my impressions of the main characters were that they looked (in my mind's eye) like Arthur Lowe (Bryant), and John Le Mesurier (May). Their first names are Arthur and John, but so are a lot of people. Christopher Fowler said on his website, that they were definitely based on Lowe and Le Mesurier. I only found his website some time after reading the books.Whatever, I do enjoy their often barking plots, and well-drawn characters. Yes, I love these books. I've read them all, and am eagerly awaiting the next one (2018). Here's what I said about the latest one, in the Everlasting Club: "...in Christopher Fowler's Strange Tide, his elderly policemen, Bryant & May, and their motley team of men, women and 'staff cat' Crippen, have a river-based mystery to solve. The body of a young woman is found chained to an old mooring stone on the shore of the Thames, near the ruins of St Dunstan in the East. Naturally, it isn't the only death. The Bryant & May books are in some ways much lighter than the Shadow Police series - there are laugh-out-loud moments in them - and yet they're also darker and more downbeat in their portrayal of London. In Strange Tide, Fowler spends time recounting the folklore and history of the Thames, as well as brilliantly evoking its present state, all of it as black as black can be (as Arthur Bryant says to a Thames expert he's called on: "Well, thank you for that... I'd love to stay and chat longer but I'd end up killing myself"). Apart from the non-canonical Rune (reviewed in G&S all those many years ago), the Bryant & May books always seem to tread a very narrow line between supernatural and non-supernatural fiction, never quite toppling over onto the supernatural side. Strange Tide is no exception, even though it begins to look as if it's edging toward that side when Bryant starts having visions of past London (there is a medical explanation!). The Bryant & May series is definitely not running out of steam, despite being in double figures already - I'd rate Strange Tide as one of the best so far." You mention the "Rivers of London" books. I'm unfamiliar with the "Vinyl Detective" ones, which I must look into. Have you read Paul Cornell's brilliant "Shadow Police" series (now sadly curtailed)? They too are set in that "hidden London" you (and I) find so fascinating. |
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Post by ropardoe on Oct 25, 2017 8:25:16 GMT
Anyone here been reading these? I kept seeing them mentioned in glowing terms, and so I got the short story collection, 'England's Glory', to ease me in to their strange world. It took ten pages to become hooked. Within the month, I had every book in the series, and worked my way through them. A totally enjoyable journey, to be sure. Enjoyable on a similar level to Ben Aaronovitch's deliciously odd 'Rivers Of London' series, and Andrew Cartmel's brilliantly nerdy 'Vinyl Detective' books. Bryant and May's London is the London that fascinates me, where tourist has never trod. Oddly, my impressions of the main characters were that they looked (in my mind's eye) like Arthur Lowe (Bryant), and John Le Mesurier (May). Their first names are Arthur and John, but so are a lot of people. Christopher Fowler said on his website, that they were definitely based on Lowe and Le Mesurier. I only found his website some time after reading the books.Whatever, I do enjoy their often barking plots, and well-drawn characters. Yes, I love these books. I've read them all, and am eagerly awaiting the next one (2018). Here's what I said about the latest one, in the Everlasting Club: "...in Christopher Fowler's Strange Tide, his elderly policemen, Bryant & May, and their motley team of men, women and 'staff cat' Crippen, have a river-based mystery to solve. The body of a young woman is found chained to an old mooring stone on the shore of the Thames, near the ruins of St Dunstan in the East. Naturally, it isn't the only death. The Bryant & May books are in some ways much lighter than the Shadow Police series - there are laugh-out-loud moments in them - and yet they're also darker and more downbeat in their portrayal of London. In Strange Tide, Fowler spends time recounting the folklore and history of the Thames, as well as brilliantly evoking its present state, all of it as black as black can be (as Arthur Bryant says to a Thames expert he's called on: "Well, thank you for that... I'd love to stay and chat longer but I'd end up killing myself"). Apart from the non-canonical Rune (reviewed in G&S all those many years ago), the Bryant & May books always seem to tread a very narrow line between supernatural and non-supernatural fiction, never quite toppling over onto the supernatural side. Strange Tide is no exception, even though it begins to look as if it's edging toward that side when Bryant starts having visions of past London (there is a medical explanation!). The Bryant & May series is definitely not running out of steam, despite being in double figures already - I'd rate Strange Tide as one of the best so far." You mention the "Rivers of London" books. I'm unfamiliar with the "Vinyl Detective" ones, which I must look into. Have you read Paul Cornell's brilliant "Shadow Police" series (now sadly curtailed)? They too are set in that "hidden London" you (and I) find so fascinating. Correction - Strange Tide isn't the latest - there's been one more since, whose title escapes me for the moment, but it's just as good as the rest. |
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elricc
Devils Coach Horse
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Post by elricc on Oct 25, 2017 12:14:28 GMT
I love Bryant & May, I believe the next one is going to be set in the 60's, like you I love all the little gems about London, I think my favourite is the second in the series the Water Room. Christopher Fowler's blog is great as he often posts about his London research for upcoming B & M books. I am enjoying/enjoyed the Rivers of London, less so the Shadow Police, Have you read the Midnight Mayor series? Came out some time ago but I just re-read them.
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Post by valdemar on Oct 25, 2017 17:26:58 GMT
The next book is indeed touted to be set during the cold war period. That's what makes B&M so good - they have been detectives for so long, that there must be a huge selection of weird cases spanning the latter 20th, and early 21st centuries. Another good thing, is that apart from two books, the series can happily be read in any order. As I read them, I was reminded of the singularly odd 1960's ITC show 'Department S', which, if I remember rightly, was a team that solved cases that nobody else would touch with a bargepole.
The other authors I mentioned (Aaronovitch, Cartmel) have been joined here by Paul Cornell. All three have a common root, which is Doctor Who. All have written TV stories, and/or novels in the past. The last thing I saw Paul Cornell's name on was a new iteration of the classic horror comic character Vampirella.
Christopher Fowler's two volumes of memoirs, 'Paperboy' and 'Film Freak' are utterly fascinating, and, as a movie promoter, Fowler came up with one of the greatest teaser tags in movie history: 'In space, no-one can hear you scream.' (Alien, 1979). You've got to love him just for that. Fowler's blog is endlessly fascinating, and I'm slowly chugging through them. The newer entries I often reply to, as he always brings up interesting things, a bit like a dredger carving through a submerged museum. What I'm trying to say is simply, give it a look.
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Post by valdemar on Oct 25, 2017 17:35:26 GMT
One more tiny thing: Whenever Arthur Bryant goes to see his good friend (and witch), Maggie Armitage, my mental picture of her is of the brilliant Miriam Margoyles. Isn't that odd?
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Post by helrunar on Oct 25, 2017 19:18:08 GMT
I'm interested in this series, never having heard of it. Ro, did you read Rune? Any thoughts? That one jumped out at me for obvious reasons.
cheers, H.
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Post by ropardoe on Oct 26, 2017 10:16:09 GMT
I love Bryant & May, I believe the next one is going to be set in the 60's, like you I love all the little gems about London, I think my favourite is the second in the series the Water Room. Christopher Fowler's blog is great as he often posts about his London research for upcoming B & M books. I am enjoying/enjoyed the Rivers of London, less so the Shadow Police, Have you read the Midnight Mayor series? Came out some time ago but I just re-read them. No, the Midnight Mayor series is new to me. Another one to investigate. Why are you less keen on the Shadow Police series, I wonder? The beginning of book one is a bit of a drag (it doesn't even seem to be shaping up to be supernatural for quite a long while), but once things get going I think the books are just as good as Fowler and Aaronovitch (which is very good indeed!). There'll be an article on the Shadow Police books in my 2018 collection from Shadow Publishing, by the way. |
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Post by ropardoe on Oct 26, 2017 10:19:06 GMT
I'm interested in this series, never having heard of it. Ro, did you read Rune? Any thoughts? That one jumped out at me for obvious reasons. cheers, H. Yes, Rune is the first appearance of Bryant and May, and is far more supernatural than anything that follows (for those who haven't read it, there's a clue as to which M.R. James story inspired it!). But the book isn't considered canonical - the characters aren't quite the same and the whole feel is different. I liked Rune, but not as much as what was to follow. |
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elricc
Devils Coach Horse
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Post by elricc on Oct 26, 2017 12:14:59 GMT
I think I found it to be less eccentric/whimsical and quirky which is what I like about B&M,
I struggled with the first book, found it slow and a bit like someone had watched the Bill too much, and I found the whole hell story line a bit not fitting with the rest of the books. I did like witch at West Ham though, well put together but didn't warm to the characters.
Kate Griffin , there are 4 books in her midnight Mayor series, urban sorcerers, the intrinsic power of London, bizarre religous orders, tribes and clans.. I really enjoyed them.
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Post by Dr Strange on Oct 26, 2017 16:05:22 GMT
Yes, I'm a fan too. I've read them all up to Strange Tide. He does play a bit with the possibility of the supernatural, but it's really just a tease. Actually the biggest disappointment I've had with these books was when he introduced a Crowley-esque occultist villain called "Mr Merry" in Invisible Code, and then quickly discarded him in the next book (The Bleeding Heart). Also, I remember reading somewhere that "Bryant & May" very nearly became a TV series - apparently they got all the way to having Michael Gambon and Derek Jacobi sign up for the leads but, in the end, none of the UK TV channels were willing to put up the money.
I read the first two books of both the Rivers of London and the Shadow Police series, but I don't think I will be reading any more - the whole "urban fantasy" genre just rubs me up the wrong way, it's all a bit too close to Harry Potter for me.
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Post by ropardoe on Oct 26, 2017 18:06:17 GMT
Yes, I'm a fan too. I've read them all up to Strange Tide. He does play a bit with the possibility of the supernatural, but it's really just a tease. Actually the biggest disappointment I've had with these books was when he introduced a Crowley-esque occultist villain called "Mr Merry" in Invisible Code, and then quickly discarded him in the next book ( The Bleeding Heart). Also, I remember reading somewhere that "Bryant & May" very nearly became a TV series - apparently they got all the way to having Michael Gambon and Derek Jacobi sign up for the leads but, in the end, none of the UK TV channels were willing to put up the money. I read the first two books of both the Rivers of London and the Shadow Police series, but I don't think I will be reading any more - the whole "urban fantasy" genre just rubs me up the wrong way, it's all a bit too close to Harry Potter for me. It depends on the urban fantasy in question. I don't get any sort of Harry Potter vibe from Aaronovitch or Cornell (thank goodness), but I do take your point about urban fantasy in general: I've tried several other series and often had to give up after a few chapters - I like my urban fantasy more solidly in the real world than some of the series offer. But one of my absolute all-time favourite books is urban fantasy (written before the genre had a name, I suspect): Megan Lindholm's Wizard of the Pigeons. Set in Seattle, it's a book I've reread at least half a dozen times. To me, there's something very special about it, yet it's not a book which her fans (she's also Robin Hobb) think very highly of. For me, she's never written anything else quite as wonderful except The Gypsy, which she co-wrote with Steve Brust, and which is also urban fantasy (set in Ohio) - another book I've reread several times, |
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Post by Dr Strange on Oct 26, 2017 18:31:23 GMT
I think I've had this conversation (with someone else) before, but Rivers of London especially gave me the Harry Potters - the main character is "an apprentice wizard", and it seems that learning to be "a wizard" is about as difficult and dangerous as learning to ride a bicycle (maybe even less so). This (I think) maybe the real reason I don't like urban fantasy - the supernatural/occult is presented as being so mundane and everyday and easy, that in a way it seems to me to be the opposite of "horror". I've never actually read any "paranormal romance" - but that seems to be very much in the same general area as "urban fantasy". I also felt exactly the same way about Buffy the Vampire Slayer (though at least that was aimed at kids).
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Post by andydecker on Oct 26, 2017 19:19:22 GMT
I think I've had this conversation (with someone else) before, but Rivers of London especially gave me the Harry Potters - the main character is "an apprentice wizard", and it seems that learning to be "a wizard" is about as difficult and dangerous as learning to ride a bicycle (maybe even less so). This (I think) maybe the real reason I don't like urban fantasy - the supernatural/occult is presented as being so mundane and everyday and easy, that in a way it seems to me to be the opposite of "horror". I've never actually read any "paranormal romance" - but that seems to be very much in the same general area as "urban fantasy". I also felt exactly the same way about Buffy the Vampire Slayer (though at least that was aimed at kids). This is a very good definition. I must have read tons of urban fantasy for work, even the romance stuff. Of course there a big differences in quality. You had writers like DeLint who crafted diligent works of fantasy, at the end of the road you had those mostly awful factory books where the heroine was a elf/vampire/ghost/whatever badass patroling her turf in downtown L.A./New York/bugfuck redneck county, preventing the apocalypse four times a year. Especially after the success of tv-series like Bad Blood this stuff was everywhere. The horror elements in these are nothing more then props. A monster mash.
It is quite fascinating how this category developed. Last man standing seems to be the Magic Academy novel, mostly on the YA market. Another thing Harry Potter spawned.
I never read one of Fowler's 'Bryant&May' novels, but was tempted. I always thought these had supernatural elements. So these are just normal crime stories, only against a London background? Not that there is anything wrong with this, Fowler is a terrific writer.
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Post by valdemar on Oct 27, 2017 2:21:00 GMT
Andy Decker - the Bryant And May stories do touch on the supernatural, but not to the detriment of the story. Arthur Bryant knows lots of 'fringe' people, who can help when needed. His usual contact is the delightfully eccentric White Witch, Maggie Armitage, who knows people, who know people, if you get my drift. Some of Bryant's occult contacts are 'normal' law-abiding people; others are known to the police. The occult in B&M, is sometimes front and centre, other times, a beautifully constructed 'MacGuffin'. A lot of the time the occult angle is based on well known (and not so well known) London Folklore. You won't find any trite 'boy wizard' bollocks in these books, just extremely satisfying plots, good jokes and pop culture references, and beautifully drawn and realised characters.
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