Arthur C. Clarke

[Knygathin]

Childhood's End seems too contemporary, and steeped in naive politics. And the structure, with aliens quickly transforming humanity, not convincing enough. I have opted out of it. . . . perhaps return later.

[Knygathin]

This The City and the Stars is almost too much for me. It pulls my sanity apart. Not sure if I'm going to continue reading. I had to pause.

Still, this is the sort of weirdness I always look for in fiction. But now when I finally get it, it seems I sink down into it over my head.

It tells of the very far future. Man's advancement of science has blurred the border between thought and matter. I wonder if this kind of manipulation of molecules, and matter organisers, is even theoretically possible. It may be. But in any case, it is not for our minds of today to grasp. Not at all. It is way beyond our evolution. And I doubt it is even healthy to mentally linger over. Clarke was most obviously not a commercial writer, but someone who put his own soul at stake in his explorations. The human anatomy of the future has basically been preserved through cell memory banks and by controlled synthetic birth. It had been changed, however, from its original primitive form, rebuilt to abolish ills of the flesh. Such unnecessary appurtenances as nails and teeth had vanished. The conception of voluntary loss of the teeth, feels totally weird, because it goes against a firmly ingrained set of emotional standards and principles of our being. It dares oppose it. *I'm beginning to feel sick.* The teeth are critical to our health, their condition intimately tied up with anxiety, and they are central to our appearance and social interaction with others. Here Clarke's greatness is revealed. Only a person with willingness to sacrifice his own sanity and social identification with current Humanity, and a certain degree of misanthropy, would come up with this kind of preposterous idea. He burns himself to the cause of ecstatic sin. (Fact is, that from early on he separated from his wife, he had no children, and fled to isolate himself on Sri Lanka.) Furthermore change; future male and female genders are difficult to distinguish from each other. Man's equipment no longer hangs in Nature's original inelegant and hazardous way, but is neatly stowed internally when not required.

So, I think you all can well understand why I couldn't go on reading. Madness awaits the rashly overbold reader.

[Jojo Lapin X]

Feb 26, 2013 19:41:27 GMT Knygathin said:

Only a person with willingness to sacrifice his own sanity and social identification with current Humanity, and a certain degree of misanthropy, would come up with this kind of preposterous idea. He burns himself to the cause of ecstatic sin. (Fact is, that from early on he separated from his wife, he had no children, and fled to isolate himself on Sri Lanka.)

Yes, it could well be that he moved to Sri Lanka to sacrifice his own sanity and social identification with current Humanity. Either that or to have easy access to young boys.

[pulphack]

Of course, this is all just scurrillous rumour... but then they said that about Mr Savill, too. Brings a whole new meaning to the Mysterious World Of Arthur C Clarke.

[Knygathin]

Well, whatever about Clarke's sexuality, and he may have been decadent, but if he didn't commit any serious crimes, I really don't care as long as he was an interesting thinker. The City And the Stars was amazing! His writing may be cold, but it is definitely worthwhile.

I have just ordered Childhood's End and Rendezvous With Rama. We'll see what they will bring. They may be even colder. I don't mind! It's the Lovecraftian perspective of "cosmic outsideness". (Although Lovecraft was not a cold writer.)

[Craig Herbertson]

May 15, 2013 9:15:55 GMT Knygathin said:

Well, whatever about Clarke's sexuality, and he may have been decadent, but if he didn't commit any serious crimes, I really don't care as long as he was an interesting thinker. The City And the Stars was amazing! His writing may be cold, but it is definitely worthwhile.

I have just ordered Childhood's End and Rendezvous With Rama. We'll see what they will bring. They may be even colder. I don't mind! It's the Lovecraftian perspective of "cosmic outsideness". (Although Lovecraft was not a cold writer.)

The danger I suppose is that anyone famous can be prey to malicious gossip. In this case the article below seems to debunk the widespread view that he admitted preying on children. Unfortunately once these things are out its difficult to know what to believe. In the end you have to basically trust your own judgement. I found his writing cold and clinical but sometimes very interesting and I find it easier to separate in my mind any value judgements about his character from an evaluation of his writing. The unfortunate truth about 'literature' is that you would have to ditch a fair number of enjoyable reads if you were to follow a very judgmental path. You would also have to deal with historical context - any society will have its own values and, as values change, so perception changes about what is criminal and what is not, what is good and what is not. One follows a dangerous and circuitous path going from extremes of blowing up ancient statues under extreme Islam or banning Harry Potter in the bible belt in the USA. I'm not sure 'not caring' is the answer, it might be better to simply avoid the issue in a cold Clarkian manner. You can condemn the artist but commend the art.

ianhamet.wordpress.com/2008/03/18/clarke-slander-and-gross-epistemological-errors/

[Knygathin]

I share your view Craig.

There is also a risk of intellectually limiting oneself, if one's ego is so sensitive that it needs, must have, only authors that reflect its own limited philosophy. In the case of Clarke, he was a man steeped exclusively in science, and he is able to create magic writing by scientific reference alone. I am sure that he would have shaken his head, or even laughed at me, for my own interest in more spiritual dimensions and even studies of astrology. But I don't mind, because I stand firm enough to withstand that, I don't even feel provoked.

In my own case, it might also be said, that I, differing from most modern readers, share the conservative ideas of older writers, as opposed to the liberal cultural decline that corrupts society today.

[Knygathin]

Childhood's End: CREEPY! . . . Humans's despair at being overcome by a superior life form. Not sure if it is Clarke's writing, or my own imagination from collected experience. But this book feels powerful. Invading space ships hover silently for a week over all the World's major cities. A week's time is enough to collect the essence of human thinking and reference of perspective. After that interval the aliens send out a representative messenger voice, in perfect English articulation, and of so convincing and psychologically coloured argumentation, that hardly anyone of the human race can withstand.

[fritzmaitland]

Heh! I'm just starting the third section of Childhood's End. Arthur C Clarke was an odd cove. Principally remembered for 2001 (and 2010 I suppose) and the TV series The Mysterious World Of...rightly lampooned by The Goodies (on LWT?) and a tad frustrating when he'd pop up on the beach in Sri Lanka to intro a programme about Bigfoot, you'd get grainy shaky footage, lots of eyewitness accounts, and then ACC would pop up at the end to mumble "Does Bigfoot exist? I think not." Gah! Every blummin' week! There's a supernatural disclaimer at the beginning of Childhood's End where the old galoot seems embarrassed to admit he did have a bit of a thing about the paranormal (But Mr Clarke! You're a scientist! Surely you didn't believe in all this superstitious nonsense? Judging by the endings of the Not-So-Mysterious World programmes, he didn't)and there's a rather intriguing Ouija board sequence. I've been fascinated by it for ages - Pink Floyd had a song with the same title on Obscured By Clouds (the last one written by Gilmour before Waters went all megalomaniac, apparently - Iron Maiden and Van De Graaf Generator also used the words, but I've no idea if any of 'em refer to the book.) And then there's the cover of Led Zeppelin's Houses Of The Holy - what a spoiler - bet the ending of Clarke's tale doesn't match it - we'll see. There's the demonic appearance of the aliens (all two of them) and a brief reference to 'race memory' which lead some to think it a precursor or partial inspiration of Quatermass And The Pit, plus big space ships sitting over major cities fairly screams Independence Day. The story itself is engaging if not terribly exciting - Clarkey is spot on about increased leisure time if a bit wayward on increased education. This is the second time I've tried it, having given up fairly quickly the first time (and deleting a recording of the Syfy Channel miniseries without watching the darned thing - and Charles Dance was in it!) I went for a second go as I recently reread Tom Wolfe's The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test for a second time, and was intrigued to see that Childhood's End (along with Heinlein's Stranger In A Strange Land - which I read as a youngster 'cos, along with the White Album, it was allegedly an influence on Charles Manson - ho ho!)was on Ken Kesey and the Merry Prankster's required reading list.

[fritzmaitland]

The ending wasn't what I expected. Hmmmmm. Will have to ponder this.