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Post by dem bones on Nov 17, 2008 18:36:26 GMT
I'd planned to take a week away, let people kick their ideas around - if any - and see if i'd sorted my own confusion by then. What a mug, eh?
First, i apologise for any mixed messages in the original post (and up top). Five attempts and I still couldn't get it right. In the end, I opted for the spontaneous approach. Perhaps overly aggressive in places, but if i'd just hinted at the problems yet again, nobody would've paid the slightest attention. This is equally random but hopefully, it addresses some of the issues.
Easy ones to clear up.
I'm not deleting anyone's work and honestly can't see how anyone arrived at the conclusion! Sure, I want to restore the vintage pulp and horror books to prominence - that's still the big plan - but I'm not a vandal, nor am i so disrespectful toward the efforts of others! As has been pointed out: it was me who encouraged several people to post on a variety of new-horror interest threads.
Maybe this is a better way of putting it:
Rigging the last thirty posts is certainly what i'm looking to do because that's where many of us head first. Ours were starting to look identical to those of Shocklines and BFS. I've got no problem with those groups at all - on the contrary, they're so good at what they do, they certainly don't need us to mutate into a Pound shop version. We were of more use - if that's the word - in our earlier incarnation, when it was virtually all about battered old paperbacks and if this can be salvaged, we're going back that way, definitely, 'specially now that Rog has started Filthy Creations for those who love contemporary horror fiction and is even providing space for you to pimp your work. Does that mean we shouldn't mention an upcoming event, a new book, mag, site? No, I can't see a problem with that, but it won't be showing up in last thirty or google search engines for a while. Personally, i love the off-topic section too, for the more lunatic chat threads, and have even been known to wish people a happy birthday, get well soon, etc. Trouble is, it can crowd out the reviews. Nobody can demand a response to what they post, but if you've spent ages on an article and it's pushed out of sight by a stream of two or three word posts, an ad and a smiley (or this post), well, you wouldn't bother doing it very often, would you?
So the news and off topic sections will soon become visible only when you've logged in. I will be looking at ways of giving more emphasis and encouragement to those members who celebrate the work of others at least as vociferously as they do their own, and i would love to get our rather punky attempt at being bibliophiles and reviewers of beautifully-terrible trash horror novels back on track. It would sure be nice to be able to laugh loads again too. Anyone have a problem with that?
Other thoughts.
It's not 'my' board and i'm sure that's already been explained several times over.
People who've mentioned feeling guilty about promoting new - or their own - books, comics. There is a section devoted to new horror and it's staying - why should you feel guilty to contribute to it? Charles in particular, Black Book is as intrinsically linked to Vault as Paperback Fanatic and yes, Filthy Creations. If you remember, in the 2007 round-up we were all teasing you about not being so hot on this self-promotion thing - and commending you for it.
Private messages, private emails. They're called 'private' for a reason. They don't belong on the board.
You know, I could've sworn I changed the wording on the banner when we moved ....
I'm deeply sorry people felt the need to leave and even more depressed that people began tearing into each other today. Actually, it didn't look too bad when I first logged in (the early exchanges, while heated, don't strike me as that unreasonable) and i loved that people had started getting going on BOOKS again.
Thanks to ALL of you who expressed an opinion. I'll TRY and answer all the pm's too - just give me a few days.
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Post by carolinec on Nov 17, 2008 19:15:19 GMT
People who've mentioned feeling guilty about promoting new - or their own - books, comics. There is a section devoted to new horror and it's staying - why should you feel guilty to contribute to it? Right, deep breaths - I've got a few more comments/questions. But pleeeeeease, no aggro from anybody! That's all very well if you say the "new" bit is staying. I'd love nothing more than for the Vault to be as I thought it was before - all-inclusive. But now that all these views have surfaced, I'm not sure that's going to satisfy those who are arguing for a cut-off point and saying it should be old stuff only. I really don't understand the distinction between what some people are calling "intellectual" horror and the other horror, therefore I have no idea whether the kind of stuff I'd post would be the sort that people here want or not now. All this has left me totally confused! So what's happening now is that the early Vaulters are getting annoyed and going because they still feel that us newcomers are highjacking the place, and the newer ones are all going because we don't feel our interests are welcome here any more. A very bad situation, obviously! I'm not sure how you resolve that, but I really do feel that needs resolution before we can get back to any sense of normality here. I'd urge anyone thinking of leaving here completely not to for the time being - let's see what direction things go in. There's no reason why people can't visit here AND Rog's new board. Let's relax, participate where we feel able/wanted/comfortable, and see how things go. Now, it's about time I stopped poking my nose in where it's probably not wanted ...
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Post by killercrab on Nov 17, 2008 19:35:12 GMT
I really don't understand the distinction between what some people are calling "intellectual" horror and the other horror, therefore I have no idea whether the kind of stuff I'd post would be the sort that people here want or not now. >> I guess I'm to blame for the intellectual comment. The idea that you're dumb if you want to limit the topics was dumb in itself. Nothing wrong with selectivity . For now I'll hang around and see how things work out. ade
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Post by mattofthespurs on Nov 17, 2008 19:41:41 GMT
I really don't understand the distinction between what some people are calling "intellectual" horror and the other horror, therefore I have no idea whether the kind of stuff I'd post would be the sort that people here want or not now. All this has left me totally confused! Not fussed whether new horror stays or not tbh. I have a great inbuilt filter that means I only read what I want. Thought everyone had one of these but obviously I was wrong. And just to put the record straight; Apparently liking 'Intellectual horror' means you are a f*cking tw@t (if memory serves and there are lots of times at my age when it doesn't) going by one very notable phrase that was bandied around. Personally I have been called a darn sight worse so it doesn't bother me but although I am very much a newbie (a newbie on this board I may add. I think I personal library of over 10,000 pulp volumes classes me above a newbie in general) I don't think I have seen so many toys thrown out of so many prams for many a year. Very entertaining it was too. They really should legalise brothels, because, oh brother, do some people need to get laid. Anyway, whatever happens, thanks to this site I was turned onto "The Death Of Grass", "the Furies", and several other books that have been off my radar until this forum. For that I give my most humble thanks. Job done. Cheers.
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Post by dem bones on Nov 17, 2008 21:05:17 GMT
Caroline, ade. Like the sage FM said, it ain't over 'til it's over. We lost loads when we left suddenlaunch, chances are we'll lose as many - or more - this time. If needs be i'll start again and those who wanna come are welcome, those who don't, no hard feelings.
But i'd still like a crack at rejigging/ salvaging this Vault thing first 'cause there's some good work on here.
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Post by Craig Herbertson on Nov 17, 2008 21:28:31 GMT
Well, I have the mentality of a two year old and I'm staying in the pram.
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Post by mattofthespurs on Nov 17, 2008 21:57:38 GMT
Well, I have the mentality of a two year old and I'm staying in the pram. Join the gang.
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Post by carolinec on Nov 17, 2008 23:07:24 GMT
But i'd still like a crack at rejigging/ salvaging this Vault thing first 'cause there's some good work on here. Absolutely! ;D
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Post by weirdmonger on Nov 18, 2008 9:11:52 GMT
Not a shattered forum but a place for terror tales. Didn't want to leave on a bad note.
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Post by dem bones on Nov 18, 2008 9:35:27 GMT
Something i should have done yesterday is thank those who've felt the need to leave for their contribution to Vault, not least the miserable 'Who Will Save Vault' thread. You got the 'mixed messages' right, that's for sure Take care, Des and good luck to you and yours.
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Post by benedictjjones on Nov 18, 2008 9:54:16 GMT
will leaving the new sections work though dem? i'd love for everything to stay but for us to push on with more pulp (an excuse for me to buy more yellowing books!!) BUT... since the old vaulters aren't posting as much and some have vanished what is to stop more posting going in the new section etc?? personally iw ill try and level my posting out a bit. for every comment on something from the noughties etc. i'll actually try and write something on a pulp i've read. i hope the vault stays as it really helps me get through the day. b.
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Post by carolinec on Nov 18, 2008 11:24:31 GMT
will leaving the new sections work though dem? When you say LEAVING the new sections, I think I'm confused again! Do you mean "leaving" them as in leaving them where they are and continuing to let people post there, or leaving them where they are BUT only wanting posts on older stuff from now on? That's the crux of the matter for me now - I don't know whether this is the board for me or not until that's answered.
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Post by killercrab on Nov 18, 2008 14:41:41 GMT
But i'd still like a crack at rejigging/ salvaging this Vault thing first 'cause there's some good work on here. >>
I'd suggest fixing the banner first making sure it's obvious where this place is at!
KC
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Post by dem bones on Nov 18, 2008 14:45:00 GMT
I'm gonna do some maintenance on the board before the week is out. Haven't started yet as i'm still settling on the best way to rejig it and don't want to have to do it twice if it can be helped. The emphasis will be back on pulp horror, trash, Brit horror anthologies, novels and single author collections - from the Wordsworth interest material through to the present day. The new. You'll still have the Noughties section for anthologies, favourite authors is going no place and yes, there will even be a News section for events, new releases, blah blah, where people can pimp themselves to their hearts content because it won't affect whatever 'us' is left - well, at least, until we log in. This and that section may merge - we've way too many unnecessary ones which do pretty much the same thing. Lurker mentioned elsewhere about doing some more Ghosts & Scholars pieces? If you're still with us Lurkio then yes please. Caroline. You're not a pimp or, if you are, you're not too hot at it. You've found time to tell us about all kinds of stuff besides the books/ mags/ sites that were featuring your own work, joined in, told me off, even sparked some of our more barking threads which I enjoy and deeply thank you for. I'd like more of that. will leaving the new sections work though dem? i'd love for everything to stay but for us to push on with more pulp (an excuse for me to buy more yellowing books!!) BUT... since the old vaulters aren't posting as much and some have vanished what is to stop more posting going in the new section etc?? I don't know, Ben, but that's what we're gonna find out.
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Post by killercrab on Nov 18, 2008 14:50:47 GMT
BUT... since the old vaulters aren't posting as much and some have vanished what is to stop more posting going in the new section etc??
Nothing is the answer Ben. I like your idea of mixing and matching - at least it's balanced. Too much since we left Sudden Launch wasn't really balanced which caused discouragement for some. Also not everybody posts frenetically - but that doesn't mean they don't do good on topic posts. Less always becomes more which is why I'm advocate of the basics. It's easy to filter stuff out you don't want to read - but if concentration was more on nostalgia this place would look a helluva lot tidier for starters. Just because we talk old books doesn't mean we need to resemble a secondhand bookshop! LOL
KC
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