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Post by andydecker on Apr 18, 2020 11:41:09 GMT
I have to confess that I never even knew he existed before reading this.
What is his direction? Classic ghost tales, contes cruels?
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Post by helrunar on Apr 18, 2020 13:17:11 GMT
Hartley was a chum (but reportedly there were some tensions in the friendship) of Lady Cynthia Asquith's, and one of his stories usually shows up in the ghost books--and I think while she was still alive (I think he survived her by a decade or so), his stories continued to be anthologized in those.
I mostly remember Hartley for a novel called The Go-Between, which wouldn't be classed as horror, though it does include scenes of the boy protagonist cursing someone in a formal rite. The real horror of the story is one sadly all too realistic, the horror of actual human life, heartbreak and trauma. This book was beautifully filmed by Joseph Losey though in my opinion an important element of the ending was botched (I don't think Losey wanted really to include it in the movie).
The Go-Between, the book, begins, if I recall correctly, with a sentence that runs something like: "The past is another country. People do things differently there." What a haunting sentiment in the present age.
Steve
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Post by Knygathin on Apr 18, 2020 16:30:02 GMT
I have to confess that I never even knew he existed before reading this. ...
Please read the short-story "The Travelling Grave", and come back and give us your impression report.
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Post by Knygathin on Apr 18, 2020 16:44:51 GMT
... The Go-Between, the book, begins, if I recall correctly, with a sentence that runs something like: "The past is another country. People do things differently there." What a haunting sentiment in the present age. Steve Is that the way to go to start a great book, using a sentence charged with stimulating deeper meaning and symbolism, rather than just a plain-spoken description of some action sequence? Is poetic prose better and more satisfying, than forthright action prose?
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Post by helrunar on Apr 18, 2020 19:11:05 GMT
Hi Knythagin,
Surely the answer to your question is "what kind of book is it, and what sort of story is it going to tell?"
There's no single good way to start, but how one begins is important, I think.
H.
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Post by Jojo Lapin X on Apr 18, 2020 19:14:35 GMT
There's no single good way to start, but how one begins is important, I think. Indeed! As an author myself, I have found that if one does not begin there will be no story.
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Post by Knygathin on Apr 18, 2020 20:18:36 GMT
There's no single good way to start, but how one begins is important, I think. Indeed! As an author myself, I have found that if one does not begin there will be no story. Some 25 years ago I wanted to become an author, and armed myself with a general instruction book on writing ( A New Guide to Better Writing by Rudolf Flesch), but couldn't even decide upon the first sentence (out of surely a hundred million possibilities), couldn't decide which was the right way to start off the story, what was the most essential words to jot down, what exactly belonged in the very first sentence, ... ! So I gave up my efforts to tell my story.
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Post by Jojo Lapin X on Apr 18, 2020 20:27:38 GMT
Indeed! As an author myself, I have found that if one does not begin there will be no story. Some 25 years ago I wanted to become an author, and armed myself with a general instruction book on writing ( A New Guide to Better Writing by Rudolf Flesch), but couldn't even decide upon the first sentence (out of surely a hundred million possibilities), couldn't decide which was the right way to start off the story, what was the most essential words to jot down, what exactly belonged in the very first sentence, ... ! So I gave up my efforts to tell my story. Alas! we are not all of us cut out to be authors.
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Post by johnnymains on Apr 18, 2020 20:46:39 GMT
Indeed! As an author myself, I have found that if one does not begin there will be no story. Some 25 years ago I wanted to become an author, and armed myself with a general instruction book on writing ( A New Guide to Better Writing by Rudolf Flesch), but couldn't even decide upon the first sentence (out of surely a hundred million possibilities), couldn't decide which was the right way to start off the story, what was the most essential words to jot down, what exactly belonged in the very first sentence, ... ! So I gave up my efforts to tell my story. Did you try starting with the last sentence?
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Post by Knygathin on Apr 18, 2020 22:18:06 GMT
Some 25 years ago I wanted to become an author, and armed myself with a general instruction book on writing ( A New Guide to Better Writing by Rudolf Flesch), but couldn't even decide upon the first sentence (out of surely a hundred million possibilities), couldn't decide which was the right way to start off the story, what was the most essential words to jot down, what exactly belonged in the very first sentence, ... ! So I gave up my efforts to tell my story. Did you try starting with the last sentence? No, I tried starting with the first sentence. Is this a trick question? Anyway, I am thinking, writing is like any other craft, it requires practice of course. Best to start writing as a little kid, and grow into it, like Ramsey Campbell, and then continuously work at it. Naturally, I have written prose since I was young, but not imaginary prose. Except in early school, when we were given assignments to write essay or story. I should have learned more from it, but that was under pressure and we just had to come up with something. It is quite different to start something ambitious at leisure time. Self-criticism, fear, and uncertainty, are the greatest blocks. And lack of practice of course. And, conceivably, lack of talent. But I also see another side of it. That it may become easier to start writing as you get older, after having read a lot of books, fed by enormous amounts of prose, and with increased insights from a long life of experiences. Surely that will weed away some of the insecurities and uncertainties concerning what is essential, in decisions upon how to tell a story in a meaningful way.
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Post by helrunar on Apr 19, 2020 1:59:53 GMT
Mr Mains, I've read that Lytton Strachey's book about Queen Victoria began with the very final paragraph--he wrote that first. Then built the rest of the narrative around what led up to that final moment. I imagine there are others who have done that in the annals of authorial elaboration.
I've also read that Strachey wrote in complete paragraphs rather than one sentence at a time--a technique that potentially has as many pitfalls as it may own advantages.
cheers, Steve
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Post by Shrink Proof on Apr 19, 2020 7:52:26 GMT
I've also read that Strachey wrote in complete paragraphs rather than one sentence at a time--a technique that potentially has as many pitfalls as it may own advantages. cheers, Steve Indeed. I can think of more than one writer who never uses a sentence when a paragraph will do.
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Post by Michael Connolly on Apr 19, 2020 9:12:41 GMT
... The Go-Between, the book, begins, if I recall correctly, with a sentence that runs something like: "The past is another country. People do things differently there." What a haunting sentiment in the present age. Steve Is that the way to go to start a great book, using a sentence charged with stimulating deeper meaning and symbolism, rather than just a plain-spoken description of some action sequence? Is poetic prose better and more satisfying, than forthright action prose? I dunno.
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Post by johnnymains on Apr 19, 2020 10:07:32 GMT
Did you try starting with the last sentence? No, I tried starting with the first sentence. Is this a trick question? Nope, not at all - my short story The Rookery was done with the ending of the story written first. Then I built up the rest of it around that ending. It doesn't work for everyone and it doesn't work every time - but sometimes if I'm getting stuck - I'll stop what I'm writing and jump into another section of the story further down the road and then play dot to dot...
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Post by Knygathin on Apr 19, 2020 19:53:35 GMT
No, I tried starting with the first sentence. Is this a trick question? Nope, not at all - my short story The Rookery was done with the ending of the story written first. Then I built up the rest of it around that ending. It doesn't work for everyone and it doesn't work every time - but sometimes if I'm getting stuck - I'll stop what I'm writing and jump into another section of the story further down the road and then play dot to dot... I must say, that sounds a wonderful unrestricted way. Never even thought of approaching it like that. Seemed taboo. But filmmakers do something similar, completing different sections of the film, not necessarily in sequential order. So why not. Sounds very appealing actually. Lots of art is approached that way, painting for example. To get a grasp of things, you have to be all over the place.
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