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Post by Jojo Lapin X on Aug 27, 2010 15:11:04 GMT
There is the issue that Wordsworth essentially free-rides on the research carried out by Tartarus, Ash-Tree Press, and others. (The R Murray Gilchrist volume is a particular blatant case.)
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Post by David A. Riley on Aug 27, 2010 15:16:43 GMT
To be honest, Jojo, though I consider your comment unnecessarily harsh, I would be prepared to forgive Wordsworth far, far more than that, even if it is true, for the simple reason that they are making more than affordable copies of these collections available to the reading public.
If there were more publishers around who were not only capable but prepared to bring these kinds of books out for the kinds of prices they charge I would be more than happy. Their Tales of Mystery and the Supernatural series has been one of the best things to happen in the horror genre for a hell of a long time.
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Post by Jojo Lapin X on Aug 27, 2010 15:32:25 GMT
Their Tales of Mystery and the Supernatural series has been one of the best things to happen in the horror genre for a hell of a long time. Yes, I agree, but in many cases this has only been possible because other people have spent costly effort on researching and compiling the contents of the collections, which they can then simply copy because the stories themselves are in the public domain. As far as I know, this is not a legal issue, as one cannot have copyright in a particular selection of other people's stories. Nor do I consider it an ethical one. But it is a bit dubious from the point of view of etiquette.
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Post by David A. Riley on Aug 27, 2010 15:44:38 GMT
Not that it matters whether what you say is true or not, since Wordsworth and publishers such as Tartarus are not in direct competition. Those who want expensive hardbound editions will still go to people like them, while those who are more interested in just having a book to read will buy the Wordsworth editions, which have the advantage of not only being far cheaper to start with, but are much more numerous and aren't likely to escalate up in price when they become out of print collectors' items.
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Post by Jojo Lapin X on Aug 27, 2010 15:54:11 GMT
Not that it matters whether what you say is true or not What do you mean, is it true or not? Consider, as an example, the 2003 Ash-Tree Gilchrist collection, THE BASILISK AND OTHER TALES OF DREAD, edited by John Pelan and Christopher Roden. The contents of the 2006 Wordsworth collection, A NIGHT ON THE MOOR AND OTHER TALES OF DREAD, edited by nobody in particular, are identical, right down to the Appendix.
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Post by David A. Riley on Aug 27, 2010 15:56:07 GMT
tsk tsk, Jojo. Calm down. It's only a book.
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Post by dem bones on Aug 27, 2010 16:06:03 GMT
There's substance to the allegation, but Tartarus don't seem too put out about it. Mark Valentine has compiled two anthologies for Wordsworth - The Black Veil even included stories by both R. B. Russell and Rosalie Parker - and didn't we hear from Mark Samuels that it was Mr. Valentine who recently recommended that he contact David Stuart Davies? So if they are in the least hacked off with Wordsworth they've a strange way of showing it.
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Post by noose on Aug 27, 2010 16:06:41 GMT
Would be rather poor form if they did just lift whole anthologies after others have done the legwork - I can vaguely remember Hugh Lamb telling me about something like that happening to him once - though I don't remember who he said did it.
The dealings I've had with Wordsworth suggest that they do do their research - they even came to me once to help them find blood relatives of H R Wakefield, which I found and passed on.
We also talked about trying to do a reprint of the first Not at Night book - but I had too much going on at the time and thought the project might have been more of a nightmare than the Pan research so I dropped it. Would be a good one to revisit in the future though.
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Post by Jojo Lapin X on Aug 27, 2010 16:26:52 GMT
tsk tsk, Jojo. Calm down. It's only a book. I am perfectly calm! I only brought this up because somebody was wondering why they were not winning awards for their activities.
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Post by marksamuels on Aug 27, 2010 16:38:31 GMT
To be fair, there was a bit of a rumpus a couple of years ago about Wordsworth having drawn extensively from prior Ash-Tree and Ghost Story Press publications without even an acknowledgement. Another example, of course, is the H.D. Everett collection.
So I can see what JoJo's driving at.
Nevertheless, I completely agree that Wordsworth are doing a great job in making the books available; and yes, I think the two markets (i.e. mass-market and collector's market) can operate without adversely affecting one another.
Mark S.
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Post by dem bones on Aug 27, 2010 16:50:48 GMT
Would be rather poor form if they did just lift whole anthologies after others have done the legwork - I can vaguely remember Hugh Lamb telling me about something like that happening to him once - though I don't remember who he said did it. In Hugh Lamb's case it wasn't an entire anthology. The anonymously edited Chamber Of Horrors (Octopus, 1984) helped itself to the R. E. Vernade's The Finless Death, Fred Cowles's The Horror Of Abbot's Grange, John Blackburn's Dad and Robert Haining's The Wall, all of them lifted direct from his selections. The worst of it was, the Blackburn and Haining stories were original to Return Of The Grave, so Octopus couldn't have got them anywhere else. What's the betting the editor thought "If Hugh Lamb's using them, they must be Victorian"! Ironically, i'm sure it was Hugh who rescued R. Murray Gilchrist from obscurity when he included Witch-In-Grain in The Thrill Of Horror (1975) and continued to run his stories - including The Basilisk, Roxanne Runs Lunatick and The Return - over several anthologies.
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Post by andydecker on Aug 27, 2010 17:31:37 GMT
I never used to buy Wordsworth - I have enough editions of Dracula, I thought - but that has changed. I bought quite a few in the last time. The Sherlock Holmes story collection, the two Holmes novel, Australien ghost stories, Hodgeson´s Carnacki stories, the Crowley. I like the introductions and the nice price. In this day and age it is quite astonishing to see such a seemingly successful imprint devoted to the classics.
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Post by Johnlprobert on Aug 27, 2010 19:14:36 GMT
Meanwhile...
Thought I might offer my comments on:
The Beckoning Fair One - I've been reading this one aloud to Lady P for the last couple of nights as neither of us has ever read it, and the experience has made both of us appreciate Onions' prose all the more. It's a fairly lengthy story with a long, slow build up that makes the ending all the more effective. Interesting that it's considered one of the greatest ghost stories of all time when I certainly interpreted it as being more a psychological tale than anything else. The character of frustrated / bored/ slowly going insane author Oleron is presumably meant to contain a lot of Onions himself (OLivER ONions). Any more would spoil it for those who haven't read it but does anyone else have thoughts on this one?
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Post by Jojo Lapin X on Aug 27, 2010 19:39:21 GMT
I read "The Beckoning Fair One" as a teenager (i.e., a very long time ago) and found it sufficiently disturbing that I have never reread it. Elio Petri's excellent 1969 film UN TRANQUILLO POSTO DI CAMPAGNA, although not, I think, an official adaptation, owes more than a little to the story.
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Post by dem bones on Aug 27, 2010 20:11:26 GMT
i'm psyching myself up for a rematch (waiting until i'm fairly sure i've enough time set aside to read it in one hit) so i'll let someone else sum up my feelings the first (and only) time i read it as a teen. From his excellent blog, here's Ed GormanThe most frightening story I've ever read is by Oliver Onions, The Beckoning Fair One. To me it's the most masterful terror tale of all. I have no idea why it scares me but it has every single time I''ve gone back to it. He struck some kind of spiritual nerve in me.i'm not sure it scared me, but it's the "struck some kind of spiritual nerve" bit that's true in my case. The most vivid memory i have of the story is when, toward the close, we have a description of Olerton's room. I could see the rotting vegetation as i was reading about it. Bernard Taylor took the gist of Onions's story and used it as the basis for perhaps his finest of several excellent supernatural novels, Sweetheart, Sweetheart - published just three years after the bizarre Cera!
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