|
Post by Knygathin on Oct 14, 2012 15:24:38 GMT
Isn't Lovecraft a writer of very typical male perspective? I didn't know women enjoy reading him. I am almost tempted to say that quiz show is a setup, and the questions memorized and rehearsed with the young woman, purely for visual entertainment. But I guess she is genuine. She must be a witch or other pagan of some sort.
|
|
|
Post by cauldronbrewer on Oct 14, 2012 15:59:25 GMT
Isn't Lovecraft a writer of very typical male perspective? I didn't know women enjoy reading him. I am almost tempted to say that quiz show is a setup, and the questions memorized and rehearsed with the young woman, purely for visual entertainment. But I guess she is genuine. She must be a witch or other pagan of some sort. Asenath, maybe? More seriously, I'm sure there are numerous women who enjoy Lovecraft's work, even if his stories don't feature many female characters of note. After all, HPL collaborated with several women writers, and a number of contemporary women writers, including Joanna Russ and Poppy Z. Brite, have written Lovecraftian stories. Before I had read all of Lovecraft, I remember leafing through those Del Reys in a bookstore nearly 30 years ago. I read a sentence, or two, about someone going down old stairs into the earth from a mossy ground. I could never find those lines again. It may be my imagination. Might you be thinking of The Dream Question of Unknown Kadath? Toward the beginning of the story, Carter descends seven hundred steps to the Gate of Deep Slumber and makes his way to the enchanted wood of the zoogs, where there is "a great circle of mossy stones." Later, Carter and his ghoul companions ascend another staircase (from the vaults of Zin) to the same woods. Does that sound familiar?
|
|
|
Post by Knygathin on Oct 14, 2012 17:51:40 GMT
Might you be thinking of The Dream Question of Unknown Kadath? Toward the beginning of the story, Carter descends seven hundred steps to the Gate of Deep Slumber and makes his way to the enchanted wood of the zoogs, where there is "a great circle of mossy stones." Later, Carter and his ghoul companions ascend another staircase (from the vaults of Zin) to the same woods. Does that sound familiar? Well, . . . I did reread The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath about a year or so ago, and didn't think of it. But it may very well be the case! This story is told on such a grand scale. I seem to remember the scene in a more mundane or rural environment. With moss above the stairs. My own desires may have affected my memory of it.
|
|
|
Post by jamesdoig on Oct 14, 2012 19:42:43 GMT
HPL collaborated with several women writers, and a number of contemporary women writers, including Joanna Russ and Poppy Z. Brite, have written Lovecraftian stories. And Joyce Carol Oates introduces this: From the intro: "Of the major tales gathered in this volume, it was "The Rats in the Walls" and "The Dunwich Horror" I first encountered at about the age of thirteen and seem not to have forgotten in the intervening years, in the way that recurring nightmares of childhood are never wholly forgotten." I guess she must have read them in Fraser and Wise's hugely influential Great Tales of Terror and the Supernatural.
|
|
|
Post by doug on Oct 14, 2012 20:17:25 GMT
Before I had read all of Lovecraft, I remember leafing through those Del Reys in a bookstore nearly 30 years ago. I read a sentence, or two, about someone going down old stairs into the earth from a mossy ground. I could never find those lines again. It may be my imagination. No, I don't think it was "The Statement of Randolph Carter", because there is no moss in that one. I already had the three standard Arkham House volumes, but bought The Lurking Fear for the cover, and The Doom That Came to Sarnath because it had some extra prose poems. The Lurking Fear illustration is nice, but the old Avon paperback of the same title feels more Lovecraftian. Michael Whelan is very far away in style from what I associate with Lovecraft. There is moss in "The Statement of Randolph Carter"....... The place was an ancient cemetery; so ancient that I trembled at the manifold signs of immemorial years. It was in a deep, damp hollow, overgrown with rank grass, moss, and curious creeping weeds, and filled with a vague stench which my idle fancy associated absurdly with rotting stone. So are you sure that this isn't it? take care. Doug
|
|
|
Post by Knygathin on Oct 14, 2012 21:51:11 GMT
There is moss in "The Statement of Randolph Carter"....... The place was an ancient cemetery; so ancient that I trembled at the manifold signs of immemorial years. It was in a deep, damp hollow, overgrown with rank grass, moss, and curious creeping weeds, and filled with a vague stench which my idle fancy associated absurdly with rotting stone. So are you sure that this isn't it? take care. Doug So there is moss! It's more likely this one than Kadath. "The Statement of Randolph Carter" is one of my least favorite Lovecraft stories, so I had reserved that romantic memory for something less dull.
|
|
|
Post by pulphack on Oct 15, 2012 5:48:18 GMT
Lovecraft's not very good on women, and it seems like that stretched to real life, but I don't think that's affected how many women like him. I like Marge Piercey, and she's crap at writing about men. Do the sexes stick to their own?
Mind you, my ex-wife liked HP and she WAS* a bloody pagan witch, so you may have a point...
(* to be fair, probably still is for all I know)
|
|
|
Post by Knygathin on Oct 15, 2012 8:10:01 GMT
Lovecraft's not very good on women, and it seems like that stretched to real life, but I don't think that's affected how many women like him. I like Marge Piercey, and she's crap at writing about men. Do the sexes stick to their own? Mind you, my ex-wife liked HP and she WAS* a bloody pagan witch, so you may have a point... (* to be fair, probably still is for all I know) I never read women writers. My impression has been that men simply have much richer imagination. Women are dull, practical minded, and in the end only concerned with what's useful. It may be my prejudice, but the books by women I tried, I didn't enjoy. But I'm getting better! Inspired to ghost stories by the discussions on this site, I have a couple I will read, who seem very intelligent; Vernon Lee: "Oke of Okehurst" Charlotte Perkins Gilman: "The Yellow Wallpaper" Also, Russel at Tartarus Press highly praises the following writer, whom he celebrates, and raises to the skies: Sylvia Townsend Warner. (She was a witch.) I have started reading her Lolly Willowes, and to be frank, she is very concerned with, and puts great weight by, earthly mundane matters. It really tests my patience, which is soon running short. Rather dull. I can well understand how she was a politically active communist. At the same time the book has something subtle below the surface, and it may improve as I read along.
|
|
|
Post by andydecker on Oct 15, 2012 8:22:47 GMT
I never read women writers. My impression has been that men simply have much richer imagination. Women are dull, practical minded, and in the end only concerned with what's useful. It may be my prejudice, but the books by women I tried, I didn't enjoy. It is a prejudice, but aside from that, don´t you think you are limiting yourself? I don´t mean the mainstream, there are as much woman hacks as there are men hacks filling the sales tables, but in a genre which has a rich heritage of woman writers as diverse as Shirley Jackson to Nancy Collins you voluntarily miss out a lot.
|
|
|
Post by andydecker on Oct 15, 2012 8:33:23 GMT
Lovecraft's not very good on women, and it seems like that stretched to real life, but I don't think that's affected how many women like him. I never thought about this, but you are right. The only modern memorable woman character in HPL is Asenath. Of course it must be atrributed to the times that Lovecraft never realized what a can of worms this story is - today it can be seen as much more horryfiying then in 30s. But aside from that there are no women in this fiction. On the other hand, except as victims - or sexuals predators and vilianess - there are not a lot of women in other horror pulp stories either. The only heroine which comes to mind is the Spider´s sidekick.
|
|
|
Post by dem bones on Oct 15, 2012 8:44:01 GMT
I never read women writers. My impression has been that men simply have much richer imagination. Women are dull, practical minded, and in the end only concerned with what's useful. words fail me.
|
|
|
Post by Jojo Lapin X on Oct 15, 2012 8:51:43 GMT
|
|
|
Post by pulphack on Oct 15, 2012 9:30:03 GMT
I read Lolly Willowes many years back and remember a very tart, sharp wit to it, though the fact it's about witches in no way equates to a horror story. It's witches in the same way it could have been dressmakers - it's just what she does.
Andy's right about the lack of women except as victims in a lot of pulp horror, but that kind of goes with the territory, I guess. There is a lot of laddishness about that kind of fiction, just as you don;t get many blokes who aren;t either dreamy or irritating gits in chick lit.
(I must sort out this keyboard - keeps doing: for ' even if I hit the right key.)
The great thing about women writers is that they are so different to men. Stating the bloody obvious, I know, but it's about getting a different buzz from a Nancy Mitford than you get from PG Wodehouse (if you want to take pre-WWII humourists as a yardstick), or a Ruth Rendell from a Mark Timlin. The greatness lies on the difference, and I think you're missing out if you don't do it, mr K.
|
|
|
Post by Knygathin on Oct 15, 2012 9:34:25 GMT
It is a prejudice, but aside from that, don´t you think you are limiting yourself? . . . Well, . . . aside from literature . . . men and women compensate each other. Biologically and psychologically. Women are pleasant to have for company, for example when cooking dinner, cleaning the house, or travelling. And if man drifts too far from reality with his spacey ideas, or if he slips in concentration and isn't emotionally present and not absolutely true to unspoken social laws, the woman will give him a painful lesson.
|
|
|
Post by Dr Strange on Oct 15, 2012 10:38:21 GMT
Women are dull, practical minded, and in the end only concerned with what's useful. In other words, women think you are useless.
|
|