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Post by marksamuels on Sept 23, 2009 17:02:05 GMT
Mark If you really don't care about the BFS awards, why don't you remove your work from the long- or shortlist when it's announced? If they genuinely, mean so little to you, and you're so convinced that the winner is chosen as a result of pressure and publicity (as opposed to people enjoying it), then surely the most reasonable thing to do is simply to remove yourself from the running? Just wondering. S That's a fair question Simon. But I think the most sensible thing to do is provide you with the answer, along the rest of the BFS, should I ever win. It would make much more of an impact that way. Mark S.
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Post by lordfroggy on Sept 23, 2009 19:30:47 GMT
Before I make any comments on this subject I would just like to point out that my views are not necessarily the views of the BFS as a whole... I suggested the second round of votes to the BFS committee to put to a vote for the following reasons: 1. Many people I've spoken to commented on the recommendations list as being too long, and that they could not possibly read all the titles on it to vote fairly. Allowing voting on the nominations list makes it far more manageable for people to read and then vote on. 2. Publicity... once the votes came in there was several months of nothing happening until the winners were announced at FantasyCon. I was hoping to have a showcase event at Alt-Fiction, which was sadly canceled last year. It was interesting to note that the highest number of internet searches for the words 'British' 'Fantasy' & 'Society' were recorded around the times when both these lists were made public. I know I certainly read more on this list than ever before. I'm not quite sure what the problem is with people posting extracts as long as they don't send them on mass to individuals. Publishers from the mainstream down to the 'small press' do this all year round, as they have invested in these writings and have to find an audience in as many ways as possible to justify the cost of publishing them. This years winners came from a mixture of the mainstream and the small press. Stephen Jones may have collected the award for Best New Horror 19 as the editor of that book, but the stories contained within are also a reason why it won. So taking that into consideration Mark, you are part of a BFS awarded anthology. I bought a copy you signed at FantasyCon last year at its launch. And I have voted in the past for your previous works, and will continue to do so in the future if 'I' feel it's the best in 'my' opinion. Voting on The British Fantasy Awards is open to all members of the society and to the attendees of FantasyCon. Just wondering why The Mist should not have been included, Dexter I can understand, but The Mist? And I would certainly be surprised if Twilight makes it next year judging by the reaction the trailer received at FantasyCon 08 , but if the majority of the BFS & FantasyCon audience happens to be fans of Twilight in the voting period then its their voice that's being heard and not mine. They will if a FantasyCon attendee or a BFS member recommends them I can certainly state that not one person on any variation of the awards list as ever approached me directly in order to win my vote. Martin
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Post by vaughan on Sept 23, 2009 19:49:22 GMT
Why do those wanting to vote have to do so much reading for the competition? Do they not read throughout the year? Are the books chosen obscure in some way?
It seems strange to me....
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Post by Craig Herbertson on Sept 24, 2009 3:16:23 GMT
I've not read Allyson' Byrd's collection.
Lately I have become obsessed with Dan Brown. I read three pages of his book Da Vinci whatever in an airport and then flicked rapidly through the chapters. I was deeply shocked to see that he seemed to have copied the plot of Robert Anton Wilson's Illuminati trilogy and then proceeded to rewrite the story as badly as is it possible to write - result millions of avid readers, endless plaudits, lots of money.
I felt quite emotional about this as it is clear to me that Wilson is brilliant writer and Dan Brown is not.
Its nice to get a prize for things and sometimes it might indicate you are a top notch writer and sometimes it might not.
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Post by weirdmonger on Sept 24, 2009 7:06:58 GMT
Lately I have become obsessed with Dan Brown. I read three pages of his book Da Vinci whatever in an airport and then flicked rapidly through the chapters. I was deeply shocked to see that he seemed to have copied the plot of Robert Anton Wilson's Illuminati trilogy and then proceeded to rewrite the story as badly as is it possible to write - result millions of avid readers, endless plaudits, lots of money. I felt quite emotional about this as it is clear to me that Wilson is brilliant writer and Dan Brown is not. Its nice to get a prize for things and sometimes it might indicate you are a top notch writer and sometimes it might not. I am so in tune with that, it has made my day. Thanks, Craig. I've felt the same thing for ages but not expressed it.
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Post by Craig Herbertson on Sept 24, 2009 9:57:26 GMT
Thanks ,
Depressing though.
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Post by andydecker on Sept 24, 2009 10:04:33 GMT
Well, it is not a very good movie, nothing I would think is award worthy. I know that opinions on The Mist are very divided. I have read great pro-reviews and even better negative reviews. I thought it in every regard a typical mainstream hollywood horror movie, which added nothing new to the old "strangers-are-thrown-together-in-the-face-of-apocalypse. It even wasn´t offensive - untill the end, where in typical hollywood fashion a new and idiotic ending was tacked on, which didn´t made sense. It was sold as daring, but it was just embaressing. (Don´t get me wrong, I am not one of those guys who think a movie-adaption should keep each and every word, this is another medium and what works on paper doesn´t necesseraly work on screen.) But in this case it wanted me to hurl something on the screen. Like I said, your typical hollywood horror movie with the patented shock-ending But I think for such an award there should be movies - and books - nominated where the work of all involved deserve the boost more. What is the point of an award if it doesn´t make people curious enough to seek the book, movie whatever out afterwards? In most of the categories this seems to be the case, it was a good mix of the mainstream and the rest. Which it should be.
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Post by andydecker on Sept 24, 2009 10:25:01 GMT
Well said!
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Post by clinician on Sept 24, 2009 15:55:33 GMT
Its nice to get a prize for things and sometimes it might indicate you are a top notch writer and sometimes it might not. That's a curiously ambivalent statement, Craig. If you're NOT a top notch writer why should you be given a talent prize anyway? 'Best Mediocrity' perhaps? Even better - 'Best of the Best Mediocrities'. Conversely, if you ARE a top notch writer, it's unlikely that you'd be insecure enough to be constantly seeking the plaudits of the BFS Congratulations to Johnny Horror and Mark S. for popping the balloon full of cosy complacency that's been floating around for a while now. And Mark, in view of your spot-on comments...if you ever accept a BFS award in the future, I'll know you've crumpled - succumbed to the irresistible lure of a small trophy and some backslapping beers. Thus, on principle, I'll stop reading you immmediately. Possibly, the whole underlying,long-term issue can be summed up in the words of the late, great B.S. Johnson: "Minimal talent requires maximum noise"
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Post by weirdmonger on Sept 24, 2009 16:01:18 GMT
And Mark, in view of your spot-on comments...if you ever accept a BFS award in the future, I'll know you've crumpled - succumbed to the irrestible lure of a small trophy and some backslapping beers. I'd also buy my ancient friend Mark S a beer or two if that ever happens!
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Post by Craig Herbertson on Sept 24, 2009 17:46:54 GMT
Apologies, but I am notoriously ambivalent and vague. i can't speak about the BFS awards and am reduced to generalisations. What I've read of Mark's work impresses me. I find it surprising that he didn't hit the mark for a prize at some point.
The general public seem to generally like crap things though.My favourite authors sold about twenty books between them yet Harry Potter books become subject to endless plaudits and sell millions. Most modern fiction I find unreadable nonsense yet anyone can point the finger at me for saying the pulp author, E.C. Tubb, was a genius.
Mark is absolutely right about the cosy world of self congratulation. Groups exist to perpetuate themselves and often judgments are made on personalities rather than abilities. The single hope of better judgment is posterity by which time we'll all be dead...
I can only apply the maxim that if one person really sees what you are doing with your writing then it was probably all worthwhile
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Post by weirdmonger on Sept 24, 2009 17:53:30 GMT
I can only apply the maxim that if one person really sees what you are doing with your writing then it was probably all worthwhile Yes, that's it. Spot on.
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Post by clinician on Sept 24, 2009 22:33:48 GMT
I can only apply the maxim that if one person really sees what you are doing with your writing then it was probably all worthwhile Erm...yes. But it only becomes truly worthwhile if that one person backs up his/her vision of your writing with some hard cash. Otherwise, it's just vanity scribbling,surely? Apologies, Craig. This is merely the cynical musing of a grizzled pulphack.
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Post by clinician on Sept 25, 2009 0:52:07 GMT
I'd also buy my ancient friend Mark S a beer or two if that ever happens! Respects to you,Weirdmonger. You and I differ only in that I'll buy Mark S the odd case of vodka on condition that it NEVER happens! Have you noticed he's suddenly gone quiet? The word is,he's gone to Honda to collect his £1.75 million award,so expect severe disruption to these boards when he returns without it.
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Post by Craig Herbertson on Sept 25, 2009 6:37:58 GMT
Hard cash. Now we are down to the nitty gritty - art versus craft. In the true tradition of making bucks out of writing may I refer you to Dark Horizons 55 where I analyse this dilemma in great depth (or write a lot depending on your viewpoint)
To be utterly honest i oscillate between the two. I can read Ulysses, and Conan the Conqueror with the same relish.
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